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I've seen the Fourth Edition PHB and MM


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Richter_Bravesteel
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« Reply #15 on: May 31, 2008, 12:48:01 am »

That certainly seems to be the general thrust of the rules I've seen. That idea is boring as hell from my point of view -- both from a DM and a player point-of-view. Why not just play some like Heroscape if that's what you want out of the game? It's less work and far less rules.

Seriously- even the traps and such seem completely toothless in 4E. I hate to sound bitter, but I really just don't understand where the fun is there.
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randalls
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« Reply #16 on: May 31, 2008, 07:17:20 am »

Seriously- even the traps and such seem completely toothless in 4E. I hate to sound bitter, but I really just don't understand where the fun is there.

Toothless traps? ::shaking head:: something tells me the DMG is not going to impress me.
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DrBadLogic
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« Reply #17 on: May 31, 2008, 10:21:20 am »

Seriously- even the traps and such seem completely toothless in 4E. I hate to sound bitter, but I really just don't understand where the fun is there.

Off on a tangent here, but I'm always amazed how ancient ruins have perfectly functioning traps <cough>Indiana Jones</cough>.

If I ever have cause to run a game featuring ruins, I think I'll include one armed with a vast array of traps that have long sprung, or plain don't work properly any more.  Possibly including the famous overly elaborate trap that can't ever be reset, and has numerous points that could cause the whole thing to fall flat. Wink
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randalls
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« Reply #18 on: May 31, 2008, 05:36:30 pm »

If I ever have cause to run a game featuring ruins, I think I'll include one armed with a vast array of traps that have long sprung, or plain don't work properly any more. 

In an early OD&D session I playing in we spent over an hour trying to spring or disarm a trap that we later discovered did not work and hadn't worked for decades. Embarrassed
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DrBadLogic
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« Reply #19 on: June 01, 2008, 02:13:18 pm »

In an early OD&D session I playing in we spent over an hour trying to spring or disarm a trap that we later discovered did not work and hadn't worked for decades. Embarrassed

I think we could easily have an entire thread for embarassing wastes of time in game... Smiley
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randalls
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« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2008, 02:42:09 pm »

No DMG reading for me this weekend. Our schedules just aren't syncing. Sad
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xlar54
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« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2008, 04:18:20 am »

Ive seen them as well.  And the thing is, its not that I dont *want* to like them, its just that Im having a hard time in liking them period. Im glad that someone came along and saved TSR from going out of business completely, but it appears that WOTC has been incrementally trying to change something that has stood the test of time. Why not instead, re-release the boxed sets? Reprints?  Is it completely necessary to completely scrap older systems and start anew?  They take great risk in alienating their base, in my opinion, when they repeatedly do things like this.  In a day and age where kids are more into MMORPGS than pen and paper games, this seems very risky.  We've all seen it with each new release.. more and more folks deciding to not convert up. 

I think WOTC ought to stick with Magic:The Gathering (a game I am a fan of, actually), and open the license to D&D permanently.  ORICS, Labyrinths and Lords, etc are incredible works that keep the original systems alive and well.   Alas, WOTC is a company, and to make revenue, they must keep selling books.
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randalls
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« Reply #22 on: June 21, 2008, 07:13:29 am »

Is it completely necessary to completely scrap older systems and start anew?  They take great risk in alienating their base, in my opinion, when they repeatedly do things like this.  In a day and age where kids are more into MMORPGS than pen and paper games, this seems very risky.

Especially when making the game mostly combat like a MMORPG fails to take any advantage of the human GM. MMORPGs are light on anything but combat because anything but combat is hard to handle with a computer program for a GM. Worse, combat in a MMORPG or a single player CRPG doesn't require lots of record keeping or learning and applying detailed rules as the computer does all that quite well -- much better than most people.

Quote
I think WOTC ought to stick with Magic:The Gathering (a game I am a fan of, actually)...

To be honest, I think their success with MtG is part of the problem. How to make MtG a business success seems to have warped their ideas of how to make a RPG a success: lots of rules with more constantly being added, the idea that players need to master all those rules to play, the complex character build process, the randomized mini packs, the detailed tactical combats, etc. D&D/AD&D used to be an easy game for a new player or casual player to get into and play. That has not been true with WOTC versions.

 and open the license to D&D permanently.  ORICS, Labyrinths and Lords, etc are incredible works that keep the original systems alive and well.   Alas, WOTC is a company, and to make revenue, they must keep selling books.
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